HELP!! - Hair loss/bald spots

[Lucy]

Hi all,

I am new here but am very happy to have found a poodle forum! I got my first black standard in August of 07, she is now 10 months old and had some serious "issues" since November of '07. Her coat is dul, thin, shedding and she is scratching and biting so badly she has bald spots. There are NO liasions of any kind, I have changed from plastic to stainless steel bowls. We are feeding her Canadia food. She has been given a shot for pests, one for allergies and three weeks later w/ no improvement they gave her yet another shot of predizone. I have NOT taken her back to the vet because I want nothing to do with all these shots. But she looks terrible. Her main areas of biting/scratching are her rump, side stomach, base of tail, behind her back thighs and her front chest down her front legs. She is also a pitch black poodle that now has red tint to her hair and some GRAY ones coming in! This is crazy, I feel so badly for her and would love to know if anyone else has had thsi issues or heard of it?

She is a very happy and active dog.

thanks so much! My next step is acupunture/holistic vet.

Mary Jo

[zpoodle]

Have you had her tested for SA? Also a thyroid test? Also have flea and food allergies been ruled out? Just trying to think what could be causing this..........she may also need a medicated shampoo(we use the Eqyss Micro Tek brands in the shop and here when needed)............


Anyway glad you found this group............welcome.

Good luck with your girl.



Mindy
Zorcon Poodles
Toys and Standards
Visit us at:
http://members.tripod.com/zpoodle/index.html

[Lucy]

what is SA?

NO thryroid test at this point has ever been mentioned by vets. I just actually researched that myself last week. So no thyroid test as of yet either.

I don't beleive it to be food allergies as she normally never scratches her face.

The funny thing is I give her natural Cellular Defense (NCD) a product I take for myself. Its a heavy metal detoxer and balances the ph of your system. When I give her 10 drops of that a day I can NOT comb hair out of her. If i stop giving that to her I get 2 comb fulls of hair, from her back half. Isn't that crazy??? So she has had NCD very regularly and I found yeast can also be a culprit?

I started her on Solid gold Seameal Powder w/ Flaxseed Meal and that is suppose to help. I sure hope so.

We did go to my parents this weekend and she eat some of their dog food (Nutro) and is now scratching her face, so I do believe she is allergic to that food! Which I forgot to mention she overeat on in Nov. and came home and was scratching her whole body like crazy and has been since. Strange thing is it should be out of her body by now and with my food she has no issues but won't stop scratching. Unless I just need to get rid of the yeast which was cuase by the Nutro food.

[Lucy]

Oh, so frustrated, called another vet at noon and they just want to put her on Science Diet food and fill her full of meds! Why is there no other answer for these vets besides meds???? Guess doc's are the same way but with today mindset they better start looking elsewhere.

[MotherofMercies]

Sounds like allergies. My boy starts scratching around spring, but fortunately not to the point of bald spots.

Some vets are actually quite STUPID. I feel bad saying that but hey some are. I would suggest keep looking for a vet that will actually listen to you, it is quite possible that she is allergic to the meds as well. Make sure that you tell that vet all the symtoms. Tell that vet that you notice she scratches  after certain foods.

Question, did you start notice the baldness after neutering or the shots? I know my friend's Siamese cats had skin allergies after shots and neutering.

[Lucy]

thank you MotherofMercies. She started 2 months after her rabies shot.

After talking to 3 vets yesterday (total of 6 up to this point) I finally think I may have an answer to her issues. I was referred to a holitic vet in MT and did a phone consult with here. She asked me if Lucy was a hot or cold dog and I said she likes the cold, seeks it out and pants really easy if she gets warm. So she told me I had her on ALL the wrong food. Beef, chicken and lamb are all warm foods which are making her warmer. So she told me to put her on cold foods like tuna, duck, goose, carrots, apple, oranges, spinach, broccoli and white/brown rice. So I went home and did just that. She also told me to continue the NCD which I will do and give her flaxseed oil. We will try that for 2 weeks and see what happens. All I have to say is after she eat there was no scratching or it already went down in the last 12 hours....its crazy. I hope it works and will be sure to let you all know.

[MotherofMercies]

I hope all goes well

[Fluffy]

Good luck Lucy with what you are trying.  I have never heard of the hot cold thing - very curious.  I have a 10 year old brown standard who is allergic to lamb, beef, chicken and all grains but particularly wheat (even in shampoos) and she loves to sunbake and would cook herself senseless if we let her.  I worked out what she was allergic to when she was about 2.5 years old by putting her on an elimination diet using novel sources of protein and starch.  After 10 weeks it was very clear that she had food allergies - prior to this we were just guessing.

I would also be consulting with the dogs breeder and possibly testing for SA and Thyroid function as Mindy suggested.

[Lesly]

Poor Poodle girl!  Maddy had similar problems after getting a Rabies vaccination.  I, too, would rule out SA and Thyroid.  She may have food allergies, respiratory allergies, or contact allergies, or all of the above.  In the meantime, choose a single protein source food, no grains.  You can also add plain, live culture yogurt to her diet.  An Omega 3 Fatty Acid supplement will help skin and coat.  Rinsing after a bath with distilled white vinegar and water (60/40) can help, as can adding apple cider vinegar to the water bowl.  The best product on the market that I've found to help heal and immediately stop itching is Mega Tek Shampoo and Mega-Tek Spray for leave-in use in between shampoos, made by EQyss.  For thinning coat, their Mega-Tek Rebuilder is great, and have had it work on areas that were bald. 

Sure hope she gets better soon!

Lesly
Maddy, Beau, & Luc!

[auntie c]

PLEASE TAKE NOTE OF THIS DIAGNOSIS, THIS IS YOUR ANSWER...

KEEP US POSTED...

( as soon as i see any baby with dry, itching conditions we immediately eliminate salt and introduce oils)
just use your common sense as to what foods have the two ingredients...
as for the body temp, to reduce a body temp i love the apple cider vinegar to drinking water, alternatively you can you camomile tea!

hang in there,
auntie c
harry who and the high maintence pearl the girl

[zefi]

Hi Mary Jo and geez, what a lot of awful problems and I really do hope you find solutions and treatments for your poor girl.

I've been really busy and not online much for weeks so forgive me if I try to pick up some threads here...

Firstly SA is sebaceous adenitis and its a skin disorder, hereditary, in standard poodles and other breeds of dog where the hair falls out, only coarse guard hairs remain, the skin often is oily or scaley and crusty and the skin has a strong odour.

I've never heard of a dog getting SA that young however... Has anyone else? And Mary Jo never said her girl was fixed... Is she? Not that that necessarily makes a difference.

Other than that I would still think an SA test is a good idea if only to rule it out. It will involve a skin punch biopsy of the affected areas. I had Billy done but his hair loss is not SA.

Another thing I'd consider is the vaccinations and thyroid. Billy's hair loss is related to hypothyroidism brought about by vaccinations. Sure, maybe the vaccine itself didnt cause the hypothyroidism, maybe he has a weaker thyroid to begin with, but its no coincidence that he developed symptoms and got worse after being vaccinated  and improved when he wasnt. Then I had him vaccinated again and he went over the edge and now is almost bald on his back, back of his legs and tail.

I agree that food could be the culprit but I disagree that a dog with food allergies will scratch its face. Usually its anywhere but the face that gets itchy. I would definitely change her diet or try different foods to find the right one. In Australia we feed a lot of raw food so there's less chance of allergies to grain based food.

I've heard of the apple cider vinegar in the water. I was told to buy apple cider vinegar 'with the mother' in it whatever that means. LOL Stinks to high heaven and my dogs wouldnt drink the water. But it is meant to help.

Also the rinsing with white vinegar is a great thing. I always recommend it to anyone with dogs with skin problems. Its also good as an ear wash mixed 50/50 with pure alcohol.

So follow Lesly's advice on the diet and other stuff. That will help. But do have her thyroid and SA tests done for sure as well.

And speak to her breeder. Firstly if there is something like that in the lines she will know how to treat it, it could be a simple food allergy that she knows about and just feeds in a certain way and to her its no big deal.

Secondly if this is a first she will want to know for her own records. Some breeders may lie and deny anything like it exists in their lines and be unhelpful, but some will be wonderful and help you all they can. And if it is something like SA or thyroid problems or anything else like that the breeder should know to keep an eye out for it in her lines.

Good luck. Let us know how she's going with the new regime. I sure hope you sort it out soon. Billy may be bald and ugly but he's not itchy and he's happy. Your poor girl doesnt sound happy.

[E.K.]

Neither of my two toy poodles have hair loss or bald spots but Nicky the 10 and a 1/2 year old is going completely grey on the bottom half of his face and is starting to look like he has a grey beard.  Both of them have some grey hair in their ears too. It's so cute.